Thursday, January 19, 2006

 

Life after death?

Do you believe in life after death? Why?

Comments:
No. Still waiting for some of that good old empirical evidence.
 
Yes, because I would like there to be.
 
Dying in life, living in death
 
I believe in reincarnation, because I generally agree with the Buddhists on pretty much everything. But I don't particularly like the idea.
 
people spend their entire lives worrying about life after death...while i spend my entire life worrying about spending my entire life
 
No evidence, but I don't rule it out. I'll go ahead and assume there isn't, though, and if there is, it's just icing on the cake.
 
I think what needs to be addressed is our definition of life- And that the language we use can't possibly accurately describe whatever awaits us. Personally, I like to think that after that limit we call death, my definition of myself will simply have changed... No real threshhold crossed or transition having taken place. (But enough of one to convince my loved ones I've died!)

-LF
 
396 words

Think of the meetings
that had to take place for you to be born.
Go back, 5 generations and ponder
the personalities that had to meet,
be attracted, get along,
and have sex, for you to result.
It's like taking 40 people,
spread out at Yankee stadium with BB guns,
some in the upper deck, some in the lower,
some in right , some in left,
and having them aim at a mosquito
10 feet above second base,
and everybody hits the mosquito
dead on, all at the same time.
That's how unlikely it was
that you should exist.

Focus on those BB's speeding inward
from the corners of the stadium,
and realize that probability waves
from the corners of the universe
actually did converge on center
at your conception instant,
passed through center,
diverging after passing through you,
with "you" less and less likely
every nanosecond thereafter,
as your "lifeball" wave spreads
out from Mom's womb
at lightspeed, not to converge again
until reaching the180 degree point,
20 billion years across the apple.

Picture it.
How could it last longer?
There's no way.
You would have to posit 40 more BB shooters,
making the same incredibly lucky shot again,
and then 40 more, and 40 more.
Seen in this way, the desire to live forever,
or to have a second life is insane,
impossible, so far against all odds,
that the wishful basis of it is self evident.

But now comes the weird part.
Having converged, and made you,
the probability function passed through you,
and spread out , retaining
the connectedness, the polarization,
the history, the "you-ness",
more and more diffuse,
but entirely unique, completely "you",
and never to be undone.

It would require
the birth of an entire new universe
for that lucky moment
of "You-convergence"
to not have happened.

But in this universe,
that other universe is never to be.
Just this universe,
forever imprinted by the specific complexity
imparted by Grandma & Grandpa
making Mom & Pop,
who then made you, & me,
with our lifeball infecting
the Monadic Hologram with our "having-been-ness".

Should the great complexity
ever attain awareness,
our having-been-ness
will be easily readable to it,
as a portion of its own consciousness.
At that moment, we will be it,
and it will be us.

And that is as good an answer as
can be provided at this time.
 
I do not believe in an afterlife because there is no compelling
evidence for it. Tragically, all of the best evidence suggests that
When our brains go, we go. I am not a nihilist - I think it SUCKS that
death is the end of our individual awareness. I'd much prefer to live
forever - or at least much longer than 80 years or so. What a bizarre
thing is life. (I do not believe in an afterlife because there is no compelling
evidence for it. Tragically, all of the best evidence suggests that
when our brains go, we go. I am not a nihilist - I think it SUCKS that
death is the end of our individual awareness. I'd much prefer to live
forever - or at least much longer than 80 years or so. What a bizarre
thing is life.
 
I have two friends who have had Near Death Experiences. Both of them had the typical things happen, i.e. floating above their bodies, seeing and hearing things while clinically dead that were later affirmed by the attending physicians, etc.

My friends are both quiet, respectful people who only shared their experiences with me after being reassured that I would not ridicule them. They understand that most people scoff at NDE's and are quite happy to keep the experiences to themselves.

I am convinced that what they experienced was real. While hearing is the last thing to go when the heart stops, and I believe it is possible to recall hearing things for at least a short time after the heart stops, I don't believe that the ability to see and accurately recall what you saw while "dead" is possible. The fact that the movements and activities of the medical staff were recalled so accurately is proof enough that we do continue to exist after physical death.
 
Yes, the affects of our lives continue on even after we're dead. That's a scientifically provable afterlife.

Really, this is the only kind of afterlife that's needed to realize how important it is to be a moral person.

As for somewhere else after this place? No, probably now, but who knows? I don't know anybody who's tested it; so it is a matter of faith, just like belief in unicorns.

Also, even if my mind is uploaded into the great mainframe at the end of time, is it still me? Would I be me without my body, my senses, or would I be something else?
 
1) I say this all the time to my friends: Weren't you dead before you were born? What were you before you were born? I don't know what I was before I was born is what I hear...So how do you know what you will be after you are dead?

2) I have had an NDE. It's as real as going out your front door to go to work. You can see, hear, and think as clearly as you are doing right now. There is no "dream" quality to it or shifting hallucination feel at all. You are in a weird place since the physical world no longer applies, but you are still the same person.

My NDE had no heaven, tunnel, Christ, or devils. I slipped out of my body, saw outer space, said "oh shit"...waited...looked at the stars (blue tinge to some, very cool)...waited...ok where's God? I am so mad at myself for dying, I start thinking of people and realize that I will never eat food again or smell air. Then a presence shows up. He has a "greek philosopher" feel about him. He is nice, does not talk, but gives me the impression I can do better with my life. Then my ego dissolves and I lose all fear and weakness and realize that I really am a noble creature when all the earthly worries and desires are taken away...including fear of death. When I say noble, I mean you feel pure calm confidence and a sense of leadership. You have no doubts. I sense a cloak on me and then am pointed to a broad beam of light to my distant right. I rush to the beam and then enter and feel infinite knowledge stretching throughout time (the image was of books stretching from my left to right as far as I could see). I don't learn anything, I just sense that infinite knowledge is not lost but exists forever.

I then pop back in my body. I was out probably 30 seconds but it felt like 5 minutes. I am rushed to the hospital. The next day everything is "flat". 3D objects seem 2D or like there is something fake about them. My hand even feels like it's paper thin...very weird. No drugs were given to me by the hospital. It took about 2-3 days for this to fade away.

3) I have hallucinated before and I have played the "pass-out" game where you are out 5-10 seconds but it seems like 24 hours...and NDE has no distortion to it. An NDE is real, if you consider what you are doing right now "real". You are "there"...you will think as you do now. My full story is too big to post so those are the highlights. I have researched it and found others have had similar ones..which is pretty spooky. I feel very lucky and to those who worry: don't. For those who need proof: you'll get it. I am a 100% skeptical person, so I know you doubters will have a great experience like I did. Good luck!

Enjoy life and do your best. Control your ego and respect the world, but don't get caught up in desiring it.
 
Maybe. I flirt with the idea of after-life. But seeing all kind of creatures coming and going with no trace left is a bit demoralising. It seems if we allow after-life for ourselves then we have to do the same for all beings. I know humans can be extremely creative and special, but we are also just another species of animal. Maybe human intelligence is the final stage of organic evolution, since we are so close to creating life. We will modify ourselves beyond recognition within a few decades. Maybe we are special. I sometimes think of the universe as a garden where spirits are grown. In fact our bodies are like cacoons. Spirits come out of them after death and travel to their next destinations of own chosing. Like an infinite pilgrimige towards God, who sits beyond every horizon while being right within you at the same time. Cool. Death is a great loss in most cases, since every being represents a lot of accumulated wisdom and love. Why should such a loss be allowed at all? Not economical.
 
8:42 pm anonymous, is the afterlife that great? - If so why not commit suicide?
 
At 16 years old?

or at 98 years old?
 
I believe in the afterlife in a sense of extreme version of the plentitude principle. That is, from the statement "everything that can happen eventually happens" we arrive to "that which is possible - exist". Exist in the sense of "is". In one sense it means that every moment is timeless, eternal, and my existence "now" implies my existence in the ultimate sense...forever..outside of time.
"I was, therefore I am. I am, therefore I am. I will be, therefore I am". The somewhat stronger sense of my continual existence can be invisioned through realization (i.e. direct calculation) of all possible configurations of matter-information in Tipler's Omega point, which also includes all configurations assosiated with my personality.
Additionally, if we beleive in extreme version of "mediocrity priciple", that is - no place is special, no moment in time is special - then by all means, Omega point already happened..in fact, infinitely long ago..and we are alive in the eternal sense.
Ultimate immortality (Ui):
consider this - random choice of some configuration from the "collection of that which is possible" - Ui is when probability to chose configuration that includes myself is 1. There are probably many things that dont include myself, but infinitely more of them do...

Of course it all depends on what I mean by "possible" and "myself".
I probably use "possible" in as "logically possible".
And personality, Self, Identity..
probably implies something unchanging at its core, yet capable of perpetual becoming..something as a pattern in the plentitude of possibilities...

There is something of a dualism,
dichotomy - finite/infinite..
We percieve ourselves as finite, perhaps potentially infinite at best. Yet we are infinite in actuality. Could it be that the mere direct perception of actual infinity can destroy our finite self..and therefore is logical impossibility? How can finite become infinite? Perhaps by some act of "trancendence".. "willing"?
 
Any thoughts about the piece posted at http://www.michaelkbriand.net/_archive.htm?
 
Yes. We are more than parts of living
tissues. We are also mind,spirit and
a spark of the eternal.

That spark is what keeps us going when all else tells us to give up.

Death is another dimentional doorway that few living persons visit unless its by astral and even that is by accident and very difficult to duplicate on a regular basis.
 
Continuum.

When I experienced a severe heart attack and faded in and out of the land of the living during the subsequent night and day in Intensive Care, I experienced a very lucid dream: I was in a room. It was a dark autumnal night. There was a repeated knock on my door. I opened it and a withered old crone, Mrs. Collis, (In my real childhood she had given me my first weekly job, weeding her garden), hunched in my door wagging her finger at me, saying, "You missed your appointment today. You were supposed to be there to weed my garden. What's your new phone number?" She took out a stubby yellow pencil and a bit of paper. I shut the door on her.

I'd suggest reincarnation within the set of family and individuals who comprise your mileau of success and failure, completion and incompletion, reality, transcience, love, hate. Just a hunch because there doesn't seem to be enough time now to work it all out otherwise.

If not reincarnation then endless very real quantuum versions of ourselves and our choices covering infinite possibility within the instant of creation. Timeless.
Fernando's required empirical proof on the second proposition: the CD player, computer, DVD, all products of Quantuum theoretics. If they work then by extension the second proposal is a clear possibility.
 
I believe in an existence after this life, but don't have any idea what that existence might consist of. I said in another comment the closest I've ever come is pure consciousness, whatever that is.

Actually, what fascinates me more than after death is this life. I want to know why "I" exist, why "I" have this awareness, where did "I" come from & why. How I got here is much more baffling to me than where I'm going.

If I could ask one question about the universe & get the answer, this would be it.
 
of course there is. I can't be the only one who has been here before.
 
I believe in life after death because I have had three different experiences in which dead people somehow transmitted information to me.

The first time freaked me out, making me wonder if I was going crazy because I was alone but being led to do something that did not make sense to me.

I finally said in my mind, "Is someone there? Who are you? I need to know that I'm not going crazy." I was immediately led in a very specific way to the person's identity, only finding out later that the person was deceased and happened to be buried in a cemetery not far from where this other-worldly episode occurred.

The second time was after a major auto accident, two of the deceased led me to the scene to retrieve personal items they wanted their families to have.

I knew neither of them, but both led me to their items the same way the first dead person directed my actions, by somehow wordlessly impressing upon me what they wanted me to do.

I'm not going into detail here to save space and time, but the details in each of these episodes are startling and unbelievable. I doubt that I would have believed these stories had they not happened to me.

I've had another paranormal experience with a living person that proved to me there is more to life than we know. Considering my experiences with communication from dead people, there is more to death than we know, as well.
 
No... I'm still alive, how could I tell..
 
i believe this is some depiction of reincarnation actually existing.
 
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